The Winter Meetings are always fun. Especially now that Twitter is a part of the rumor mongering, the GMs and agents can’t do anything without it being tweeted to a breathless horde of followers watching their tweet stream far more intently than they have watched their own children do anything.
“The Cubs are in on Pujols.”
“The White Zone is for loading and unloading, there is no stopping in the Red Zone.”
“The Cubs are more interested in Prince Fielder.”
“The Red Zone is for loading and unloading, there is no stopping in the White Zone.”
“The Marlins are heavily pursuing Ozzie Smith, Jose Canseco, Steve Sax, Mike Scioscia, Don Mattingly, Wade Boggs, Roger Clemens, Ken Grifffey Jr., and Darryl Strawberry.”
“No, the White Zone has always been for loading and unloading, there is no stopping in the RED Zone.”
“The Cubs will add Bryan LaHair to the rotation and he will play 1st on days he doesn’t pitch.”
“Don’t start with this Red Zone/White Zone shit again.”
“Urban Meyer is flatly denying that Albert Pujols exists.”
“Why don’t you just admit that this is because I won’t have an abortion?”
“OMG! Albert Pujols’ agent just did a line of coke off a hooker’s chest that was seen with Ozzie Guillen last night! He must be going to the Marlins!”
And so forth.
Meanwhile, we still don’t have much of a damn clue what the Cubs are actually going to do. For that matter, they might not either. They are clearly interested in the idea of Pujols or Fielder, but with the Marlins throwing around cash like it’s Monopoly money, it seems unlikely that either of them come at even a semi-reasonable rate for the position the Cubs are in.
The closer market, which seemed to be a real seller’s market, got a little tighter as the White Sox pulled the trigger on a deal sending Sergio Santos to the Blue Jays to presumably fill their closer needs, so what does that mean for the Cubs who have two elite-level relief pitchers and very little need for both of them?
Aramis Ramirez could end up in Philadelphia or Milwaukee. Wouldn’t it be fun if he ended up as a Brewer? I’m not sure who would hate that more, the Cubs fans or the Brewers fans.
Starting pitching doesn’t seem like it is going to be cheap. Mark Buehrle is the last drunk ugly girl at the bar during last call that every guy is trying to take home. Sure, there might be better women out there, but this is the one here and now and the deal has to get closed.
So we wait and hit refresh on our news feeds of choice.
Still no Pujols signing.
At the time of this writing, members of Marlins ownership are meeting with members of the commissioners office. So you know what that means… they’re going to a strip club!
This episode will turn 20 years old on February 20. Suck on that.
Tonight is the arbitration deadline right?
I wonder if Pena and Ramirez will decline. Is it an auto-accept if they say nothing?
My softball team this past summer was Ken Griffey’s Grotesquely Swollen Jaw.
[quote name=GBTS]My softball team this past summer was Ken Griffey’s Grotesquely Swollen Jaw.[/quote]
I hope you managed to beat Steve Sax And His Running From The Law
[quote name=Berselius]I hope you managed to beat Steve Sax And His Running From The Law[/quote]We got ousted by Mike Scioscia’s Tragic Illness before we could play them.
[quote name=Rice Cube]Tonight is the arbitration deadline right?
[/quote]
Thanks to the Red/White zone jokes above and my fast paced reading I read this as..
[quote name=Rice Cube]Tonight is the abortion deadline right?
[/quote].
If you can’t make a decision by 11:59 PM tonight, you’re carrying that kid to term.
[quote name=GBTS]We got ousted by Mike Scioscia’s Tragic Illness before we could play them.[/quote]
There is an actual Dodgers blog called Mike Scioscia’s Tragic Illness.
http://mikesciosciastragicillness.com/
[quote name=Aisle424]There is an actual Dodgers blog called Mike Scioscia’s Tragic Illness.
http://mikesciosciastragicillness.com//quote
It would be more appropriate if it was an Angels blog
/Napoli
Huh. When I was a kid, I wondered why Steve Sax was the second baseman, and not Ryne Sandberg. According to this site, Ryno was offered the job, but turned the role down (along with Carlton Fisk): http://simpsonswiki.net/wiki/Homer_at_the_Bat/References
[quote name=ACT]Huh. When I was a kid, I wondered why Steve Sax was the second baseman, and not Ryne Sandberg. According to this site, Ryno was offered the job, but turned the role down (along with Carlton Fisk): http://simpsonswiki.net/wiki/Homer_at_the_Bat/References/quote
Ryno only appears on cartoons that animate the right way, not by outsourcing to Korea.
USAToday:
Three? Later it mentions the Cubs also have an offer that is not 10 years long, so it isn’t them.
http://content.usatoday.com/communities/dailypitch/post/2011/12/albert-pujols-marlins-cardinals-mystery-team/1
[quote name=Aisle424]USAToday:
Three? Later it mentions the Cubs also have an offer that is not 10 years long, so it isn’t them.
http://content.usatoday.com/communities/dailypitch/post/2011/12/albert-pujols-marlins-cardinals-mystery-team/1/quoteCards, Marlins and …?
Nationals already bowed out so it’s not them either.
[quote name=Rice Cube]Cards, Marlins and …?
[/quote]
Mr. Burns.
[quote name=Aisle424]Mr. Burns.[/quote]
Shortest Youtube clip ever.
So what if the cubs offered a 10year contract but severely front loaded it do that 150-160 is paid out over the first 5 years and the last half is paid out around 10-12m?
[quote name=Aisle424]USAToday:
Three? Later it mentions the Cubs also have an offer that is not 10 years long, so it isn’t them.
http://content.usatoday.com/communities/dailypitch/post/2011/12/albert-pujols-marlins-cardinals-mystery-team/1/quoteJim Hendry offered Pujols 10 years and $250 million for unknown services.
[quote name=JMan]So what if the cubs offered a 10year contract but severely front loaded it do that 150-160 is paid out over the first 5 years and the last half is paid out around 10-12m?[/quote]If they did Pujols would take that contract in a heartbeat. The present value of such a contract would be significantly higher than the other offers. I would have to say that if the Cubs made that kind of offer we can put to rest any hope that Thoyer is going to do any good while in Chicago. I don’t really want a $200 million contract over 10 years for Pujols, but I could live with it. If it’s front loaded I’ll throw a fit.
This whole third team is just Lazano trying to create more of a market for Pujols. If there really is a third team they should be given an award for somehow offering that kind of money for that kind of player under the radar.
[quote name=mb21]If they did Pujols would take that contract in a heartbeat. The present value of such a contract would be significantly higher than the other offers. I would have to say that if the Cubs made that kind of offer we can put to rest any hope that Thoyer is going to do any good while in Chicago. I don’t really want a $200 million contract over 10 years for Pujols, but I could live with it. If it’s front loaded I’ll throw a fit.[/quote]
But what if they are just letting Pujols carry the load for a couple of years and then when the burden alleviates and they have an actual farm system, they go apeshit on the FA market, with enough money left over to sign their farm products to lock them up?
I agree that front-loading a contract makes it harder to put together a team right now, but that would be true even if Pujols played for free with this team. There’s just too many holes. So they get Pujols, he makes the team almost a .500 team all by himself and they let luck play its role for couple of seasons. Hell, it hurts the Cards and the Brewers are losing Fielder, so anything could happen in this division.
Quick Ron Santo tangent:
In 1967, Ron Santo was worth 10.2 WAR.
There have only been 15 better offensive seasons since then, by 9 players: Bonds (6), Morgan, Yount, Sosa, Ripken, A-Rod, Carew, Pujols, Giambi. That’s it.
http://www.baseball-reference.com/leaders/WAR_season.shtml
What a season.
Pagan ———-> Giants
Andres Torres, Ramon Ramirez ——> Mets
424, that’s possible, but it would be a bad idea. The last thing I want the Cubs getting into is frontloading contracts so they’re actually paying the player more money in present value. A dollar today is worth more than a dollar tomorrow. $20 million 10 years from now is the equivalent of $12.9 million in today’s money using 5% inflation. If they’re going to offer that kind of contract I’d prefer they either pay the same amount each year or backload the contract so that the value of the contract is actually less.
It’s like I’ve said before, if you asked the players if they’d like a frontloaded contract they’d say yes. Lottery winners want lump sum payments because it’s worth more now than it is later. I’d love to have Pujols, but I’ll be very disappointed if the contract is frontloaded. If I was Ricketts I’d actually step in and tell Thoyer they can’t do it.
(dying laughing) let’s keep him out of the Hall of Fame!
I’m hoping Albert pulls a Cliff Lee and signs with a team nobody was anticipating for less money.
Joel Sherman says the Cubs are in the bidding for Pujols. They want to make life miserable for Cards, but also wouldn’t mind having him on their team.
I should add that if the Cubs do sign Pujols to a frontloaded contract I’m still going to be excited the Cubs have Pujols. What will frustrate me more than anything is the Cubs fans who look at the frontloaded contract as evidence that Thoyer is better than Hendry even though they paid more money than if they backloaded it.
[quote name=mb21](dying laughing) let’s keep him out of the Hall of Fame![/quote]That 6 was because of steroids.
/pundit’d
The Marlins and Cards have the 10 year/$200+MM deals right?
What’s to prevent the Cubs from going 7/200 and then throw in a “thanks for your services” option for an 8th year? Other than lack of money, of course.
What the hell is Sandy Alderson doing in NY? 3 relievers in 60mins who will be paid a combined 15M in 2012. insanity.
(dying laughing), lesbian Hobbit suggests Cubs trade for Sanchez and platoon him with LaHair.
Acquire quality cost controlled 1b, play him in less than half the games.
???
World Series
[quote name=Berselius](dying laughing), lesbian Hobbit suggests Cubs trade for Sanchez and platoon him with LaHair.
Acquire quality cost controlled 1b, play him in less than half the games.
???
World Series[/quote]has anyone heard from Deep Goat yet? Would love a good laugh.
[quote name=Berselius](dying laughing), lesbian Hobbit suggests Cubs trade for Sanchez and platoon him with LaHair.
Acquire quality cost controlled 1b, play him in less than half the games.
???
World Series[/quote]
That’s why Paul Sullivan is a Chicago Cubs beat writer and you’re…..a smart dude with a real job.
[quote name=JMan]has anyone heard from Deep Goat yet? Would love a good laugh.[/quote]
(dying laughing)
(dying laughing)
[quote name=JMan]has anyone heard from Deep Goat yet? Would love a good laugh.[/quote]I think he’s too busy looking for the next David Patton.
[quote name=JMan]What the hell is Sandy Alderson doing in NY? 3 relievers in 60mins who will be paid a combined 15M in 2012. insanity.[/quote]FA relief pitchers are the new inefficiency.
Rosenthal says Angels are pursuing Pujols.
[quote name=ACT]Rosenthal says Angels are pursuing Pujols.[/quote]
Who is that 1B they had who broke his leg? Kendry Morales? I’d be interested in him for the Cubs.
[quote name=Recalcitrant Blogger Nate]Who is that 1B they had who broke his leg? Kendry Morales? I’d be interested in him for the Cubs.[/quote]Correct, as long as he doesn’t celebrate too hard after home runs.
http://twitter.com/#!/ESPN1220/status/144245118541635585
[quote name=ACT]http://twitter.com/#!/ESPN1220/status/144245118541635585[/quote]So what’s better for the Cubs? Pujols completely out of the division or Pujols hamstringing the Cardinals for the next 10 years?
[quote name=JMan]So what’s better for the Cubs? Pujols completely out of the division or Pujols hamstringing the Cardinals for the next 10 years?[/quote]I think the NL Central opened up alot more, especially if Fielder doesnt return to Milwaukee. I’d say with current rosters, Reds are favorites, with STL just behind.
[quote name=JMan]So what’s better for the Cubs? Pujols completely out of the division or Pujols hamstringing the Cardinals for the next 10 years?[/quote]I think out of division is probably better. Cardinals still have a pretty good team after Pujols leaves, but if he stayed, they’d be better for the near future.
So I was watching Sons of Anarchy this season after skipping last season. It had been OK to this point. Better than season 2, but nowhere near as good as season 1. I’d heard that season 3 was worse than season 2. I can’t help but imagine anyone still watching that show has the least bit of interest in watching another episode at this point. That show may as well move to CBS or NBC. What a complete waste of interesting characters and an intriguing plot. Sutter should actually be ashamed of himself and give up writing. It’s actually hard to imagine a show’s season finale being as ridiculously fucking stupid as The Killing, but SOA managed to do it. Amazing.
[quote name=mb21]So I was watching Sons of Anarchy this season after skipping last season. It had been OK to this point. Better than season 2, but nowhere near as good as season 1. I’d heard that season 3 was worse than season 2. I can’t help but imagine anyone still watching that show has the least bit of interest in watching another episode at this point. That show may as well move to CBS or NBC. What a complete waste of interesting characters and an intriguing plot. Sutter should actually be ashamed of himself and give up writing. It’s actually hard to imagine a show’s season finale being as ridiculously fucking stupid as The Killing, but SOA man
aged to do it. Amazing.[/quote]
(dying laughing) my wife is watching finale right now. i refused. instead i’m reading about baseball rumors (dying laughing)
[quote name=Recalcitrant Blogger Nate](dying laughing) my wife is watching finale right now. i refused. instead i’m reading about baseball rumors (dying laughing)[/quote]
You chose…wisely.
[quote name=Recalcitrant Blogger Nate](dying laughing) my wife is watching finale right now. i refused. instead i’m reading about baseball rumors (dying laughing)[/quote]Excellent decision. I was hesitant to watch this season. Season 3 was apparently as bad as I was expecting, but I had read this season returned to its roots. Some of it was ridiculous, but some of it I really liked. 6 months ago I’d have been surprised at such a retarded finale, but The Killing topped everything anybody had ever seen. I don’t know why I’m surprised at just how bad this episode was. The show really hadn’t been good for 3 years and after The Killing I should expect retarded finales. I’m just pissed I wasted 14 hours watching that shit. I’m equally pissed that someone could take such an interesting story and shit all over it.
10 minutes to arbitration deadline.
Oh shit, today’s the 6th. I’ve lost all track of time (dying laughing)
/thesis brain’d
I’m kinda enjoying that Hell on Wheels show, altho forgot to watch sunday. I like westerns though. Not as good as Deadwood, but enjoyable.
I like Hell on Wells too, but not nearly as much as Deadwood. Not exactly sure where the show can go, but I’m enjoying it.
[quote name=mb21]Excellent decision. I was hesitant to watch this season. Season 3 was apparently as bad as I was expecting, but I had read this season returned to its roots. Some of it was ridiculous, but some of it I really liked. 6 months ago I’d have been surprised at such a retarded finale, but The Killing topped everything anybody had ever seen. I don’t know why I’m surprised at just how bad this episode was. The show really hadn’t been good for 3 years and after The Killing I should expect retarded finales. I’m just pissed I wasted 14 hours watching that shit. I’m equally pissed that someone could take such an interesting story and shit all over it.[/quote]Veena Sud is happy to be in the same conversation as SOA
[quote name=Recalcitrant Blogger Nate]That’s why Paul Sullivan is a Chicago Cubs beat writer and you’re…..a smart dude with a real job.[/quote]
link?
[quote name=Rice Cube]I think out of division is probably better. Cardinals still have a pretty good team after Pujols leaves, but if he stayed, they’d be better for the near future.[/quote]
After rethinking this…agreed. As much as we talk about a Pujols regression and how his contract will kill the Cardinals, there is still a pretty good chance he maintains a stratospheric WAR for the majority of the contract. So, probably better to get him out of the division rather than bet that the one of the greatest players of all time won’t defy the aging curve.
http://twitter.com/#!/Joelsherman1/status/144265048632729601
(dying laughing) (dying laughing)
Sounds like the Cubs are offering Albert an 8-year deal.
ESPN: Cards won’t go after Prince if they don’t get Albert. Theo is dead serious about getting either Albert of Prince (Cubsmay be trying to drive up price on Albert).
Jim Bowden: Pujols destination is down to Marlins, Cards.
Jim Bowden: Marlins have best offer, but Pujols will probably resign with Cards, anyway.
http://twitter.com/#!/JimBowdenESPNxm/status/144296034238074880
http://twitter.com/#!/Jon_Heyman/status/144293661675499520
I… give up. Good night.
Gordo pooh-pooh’s the notion of the Cubs being deep (or even shallow) into Pujols or Fielder.
Says they’re waiting for the Marlins to wrap things up, suggests Z could still go to Miami, and Sanchez to CHC.
http://www.suntimes.com/sports/baseball/cubs/9290733-573/cubs-decisions-might-hinge-on-marlins-moves.html
Funny how the Daily Herald didn’t block me from reading their front page story on the Sun-Times’ new pay wall.
[quote name=Rice Cube]Correct, as long as he doesn’t celebrate too hard after home runs.[/quote]And then reinjure himself during rehab and miss the entire season after the one in which he had the initial injury.
Also, I guess MLB had his name wrong. It’s actually Kendrys.
The Cardinals upped their offer to 10/220 according to the Post-Dispatch.
That seems like an awfully long time to hold onto someone.
Wouldn’t Pujols be better off staying in St. Louis though, financially, even if the contract is a little less? I imagine he would get a shit ton of endorsements, could get statues, could open up a restaurant chain, etc.
Also, if Pujols was to wake up tomorrow and decide he didn’t want to play baseball anymore for whatever reason, would he get in the hall of fame based on his current stats? I want to say yes, although that seems weird considering he only played 10 full seasons.
I really want Prince.
[quote name=WaLi]That seems like an awfully long time to hold onto someone.
Wouldn’t Pujols be better off staying in St. Louis though, financially, even if the contract is a little less? I imagine he would get a shit ton of endorsements, could get statues, could open up a restaurant chain, etc.[/quote]No state income tax in Florida. You have to factor that into the equation.
Sucks for anyone who was on “Red Alert” for a Pujols contract announcement overnight.
[quote name=bubblesdachimp]No state income tax in Florida. You have to factor that into the equation.[/quote]Oh yeah, I forgot abou tthat. That was the worst part about moving away from Florida.
From what I remember when I was looking for a job in StL, the state income tax is 6% and I think the city has an additional 1% tax. That’s a lot of money saved.
Ryno, don’t be so hard on him. Show tunes can rock too.
[quote name=bubblesdachimp]No state income tax in Florida. You have to factor that into the equation.[/quote]
And the whole “Florida >>>>>> St. Louis” thing.
[quote name=Suburban kid]hard on[/quote]
(dying laughing)
[quote name=WaLi]Oh yeah, I forgot abou tthat. That was the worst part about moving away from Florida.
From what I remember when I was looking for a job in StL, the state income tax is 6% and I think the city has an additional 1% tax. That’s a lot of money saved.[/quote]I have been living in Virginia illegaly for two.5 years becuase of this
two.5? (dying laughing)
I like 2.five better
Or 2.V.
Sounds like the Cardinals offer is more than the Marlins.
On that Wittenmeyer story, I think that I remember that quote about not being in “any kind of process” with Fielder from about 2 weeks ago, and the quote about eating money on a deal sometimes is totally generic. Its not to say he isn’t right, but what he’s offering as “evidence” seems to be just stuff he had sitting around.
[quote name=Urk]On that Wittenmeyer story, I think that I remember that quote about not being in “any kind of process” with Fielder from about 2 weeks ago, and the quote about eating money on a deal sometimes is totally generic. Its not to say he isn’t right, but what he’s offering as “evidence” seems to be just stuff he had sitting around.[/quote]
Money does fit in to a vegetarian diet.
Have the White Sox given up on life? If the White Sox were your cousin Murray you’d try to get someone to do a suicide intervention, which you’d be happy to go to, but don’t really feel like you know Murray well enough to initiate it.
[quote name=Urk]On that Wittenmeyer story, I think that I remember that quote about not being in “any kind of process” with Fielder from about 2 weeks ago, and the quote about eating money on a deal sometimes is totally generic. Its not to say he isn’t right, but what he’s offering as “evidence” seems to be just stuff he had sitting around.[/quote]I agree, but I highly doubt the Cubs are pursuing either Pujols or Fielder with any genuine interest. Over 9 years Pujols is worth about $215 million. He’s easily worth the $220 million over 10 years. I think if the Cubs were genuinely interested in Pujols they’d have at least offered $220 million over 10 years. They’d be right there with the Marlins. The fact they aren’t tells me the Cubs have no interest in signing him unless they can have him at a significant discount. I’m guessing the same is true for Fielder.
Jon_Heyman Jon Heyman
Carlos pena has decided he will NOT accept arbitration. #cubs
Possible we might get more serious with Fielder now?
(dying laughing)
(dying laughing)
(dying laughing)
(dying laughing)
Tim McCarver ————> Ford Frick award
(dying laughing)
(dying laughing)
(dying laughing)
(dying laughing)
I’m thinking Albert stays with the Cardinals at this point. Seeing him go to the Fish was a nice dream, though.
[quote name=ACT]I’m thinking Albert stays with the Cardinals at this point. Seeing him go to the Fish was a nice dream, though.[/quote]The secondary hope was to get the price up, and that seems to have happened. Small victories.
new shit: http://www.obstructedview.net/chicago-cubs/articles/winter-meetings-day-3-open-thread.html